[QUIZ] Proposed new rule

ruby-talk
1

The three rules of Ruby Quiz:

1. Please do not post any solutions or spoiler
discussion for this quiz until 48 hours have passed
from the time on this message.

2. Support Ruby Quiz by submitting ideas as often
as you can:

http://www.rubyquiz.com/

3. Enjoy!

    I'd like to propose a new rule (1.5?):

Please flag all submissions and discussions of quizzes by starting the
subject with the string "[QUIZ]".

    I really enjoy following the discussions of the different quizzes
even though I rarely have time to do them anymore. But in a 100 to 200
message per day mailing list, it is easy to miss a submission or a
discussion when the subject line doesn't indicate that it is
quiz-related. Apparently I am not the only person having this problem,
as illustrated by one of the RRobots submissions being missed last week.

    This doesn't seem like it would be a particularly burdensome rule,
and it would make things a lot easier to follow.

    If we want to get really bold, the rule could also ask people
submitting solutions to start the subject with "[QUIZ][SOLUTION]" :o)

    Thoughts?

    - Warren Brown

2

The three rules of Ruby Quiz:

1. Please do not post any solutions or spoiler
discussion for this quiz until 48 hours have passed
from the time on this message.

2. Support Ruby Quiz by submitting ideas as often
as you can:

http://www.rubyquiz.com/

3. Enjoy!

    I'd like to propose a new rule (1.5?):

Please flag all submissions and discussions of quizzes by starting the
subject with the string "[QUIZ]".

I'm fine with "recommending" this as long as everyone realizes that's all it will be.

    If we want to get really bold, the rule could also ask people
submitting solutions to start the subject with "[QUIZ][SOLUTION]" :o)

Yuck. :slight_smile:

[SOLUTION] implies [QUIZ], I think, so we can drop the repatition. Of course, now what you are suppose to put in the subject is getting more complicated, which probably decreases the chance that it will happen. That might be a reason to stick with just [QUIZ]. Opinions?

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving Ruby Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging you...

James Edward Gray II

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 4:23 PM, Warren Brown wrote:

3

I like this proposal, and I like implementing it as a "recommendation."

Regards,
Craig

4

James Edward Gray II wrote:

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving Ruby Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging you...

It's already threaded quite nicely. I can recall one instance, in Quiz 60, where someone posted out of thread, and that was for a new solution.

I don't mind the [QUIZ] as a "recommendation", but let's also recommend readers be threaded. Regardless, [QUIZ] makes obvious good sense.

IMO, the quiz certainly does not need its own list.

--Steve

5

I still read via the newsgroup, and I'd be sad to see the Quiz go elsewhere. I've not been confident enough to have a go yet but I enjoy trying them out, and learning from the solutions and discussion I see.

···

On Tue, 03 Jan 2006 23:04:45 -0000, James Edward Gray II <james@grayproductions.net> wrote:

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving Ruby Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging you...

--
Ross Bamford - rosco@roscopeco.remove.co.uk

6

[SOLUTION] implies [QUIZ], I think, so we can drop the repatition.
Of course, now what you are suppose to put in the subject is getting
more complicated, which probably decreases the chance that it will
happen. That might be a reason to stick with just [QUIZ]. Opinions?

I think prefacing subject lines with [QUIZ] makes good sense, and it can
be encouraged by having a header or footer in new quiz threads that
makes that convention known to readers. Confusing the issue by asking
people to use two different subject preface terms will probably just
lead to more people accidentally ignoring the convention, however, and I
think needlessly complicates the situation, so I'd advocate sticking
with [QUIZ] for all of it.

It has been suggested that other preface terms be used for other traffic
here. I don't see this as being a particularly likely convention to
actually help anything, since it won't be specifically prompted in
threads that are started by someone not in a position to necessarily
know about these conventions. For instance, someone new to the list
might not notice that he or she is supposed to start question thread
subjects with [QUESTION] (to say nothing of the fact that's quite a bit
of extra typing), and a convention like that is worse than no such
convention when it's only adhered to haphazardly, in my opinion.

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving
Ruby Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging
you...

I'd prefer to keep it on ruby-talk, personally. I don't really
participate, so I wouldn't pick up the new list, but I like to see what
quizzes come up, and I like to think about the problem domain when I see
it. I guess what I'm saying is that it's better for the lazy readers
like myself to have it on ruby-talk rather than making it separate.

···

On Wed, Jan 04, 2006 at 08:04:45AM +0900, James Edward Gray II wrote:

--
Chad Perrin [ CCD CopyWrite | http://ccd.apotheon.org ]

print substr("Just another Perl hacker", 0, -2);

7

Why does it have to be a rule at all? Seems like the only one who posts the quiz is J.E.G. 2 and everyone just replies to that post. Can't it just be a suggestion to him alone?

~ ryan ~

8

James Edward Gray II wrote:

    If we want to get really bold, the rule could also ask people
submitting solutions to start the subject with "[QUIZ][SOLUTION]" :o)

Yuck. :slight_smile:

[SOLUTION] implies [QUIZ], I think, so we can drop the repatition.

Well, no.

People have used SOLUTION for, well, solutions, for all sorts of problems that they have asked of the list.

I've begun sorting certain topics into separate directories to reduce the traffic in my main ruby-talk folder. Having all QUIZ related items contain QUIZ in the subject makes it pretty clear, as opposed to assuming that people will only post solutions to quizzes.

Thanks,

James

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 4:23 PM, Warren Brown wrote:

--

http://www.ruby-doc.org - Ruby Help & Documentation
Ruby Code & Style - Ruby Code & Style: Writers wanted
http://www.rubystuff.com - The Ruby Store for Ruby Stuff
http://www.jamesbritt.com - Playing with Better Toys
http://www.30secondrule.com - Building Better Tools

9

I agree. using [SOLUTION] by itself makes sense.

I like the idea of extending this concept further. Is it already a
"recommendation" that new software announcements (or updates) have
[ANN] in their subject line?

How about [QUESTION] for people looking for programming help, as well? ;o)

-Justin

···

On 1/3/06, Craig Demyanovich <demmer12@fastmail.us> wrote:

I like this proposal, and I like implementing it as a "recommendation."

Regards,
Craig

10

+1

Please don't take the quiz to its own list James! I look forward to reading the solutions and writeups very much and would consider ruby-talk to be the perfect place for the quiz.

-Ezra

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 4:32 PM, Ross Bamford wrote:

On Tue, 03 Jan 2006 23:04:45 -0000, James Edward Gray II > <james@grayproductions.net> wrote:

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving Ruby Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging you...

I still read via the newsgroup, and I'd be sad to see the Quiz go elsewhere. I've not been confident enough to have a go yet but I enjoy trying them out, and learning from the solutions and discussion I see.

--
Ross Bamford - rosco@roscopeco.remove.co.uk

11

This is how I've been operating, not wanting to get too heavy handed with the rules. It works more often than it does, I think. There's still times when it doesn't. I'm not sure if adding a rule will fix that or not.

Seems that the quiz can stay here a bit longer. (At least that's what I'm hearing.) I'm grateful you all are so tolerant of our playing around.

Let me here a few more opinions on the [QUIZ] rule, and I'll add it if that seems a popular request...

James Edward Gray II

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 7:26 PM, J. Ryan Sobol wrote:

Why does it have to be a rule at all? Seems like the only one who posts the quiz is J.E.G. 2 and everyone just replies to that post. Can't it just be a suggestion to him alone?

12

Full ack to all points, Stephen.

···

On 2006-01-04, Stephen Waits <steve@waits.net> wrote:

James Edward Gray II wrote:

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving Ruby
Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging you...

It's already threaded quite nicely. I can recall one instance, in Quiz
60, where someone posted out of thread, and that was for a new solution.

I don't mind the [QUIZ] as a "recommendation", but let's also recommend
readers be threaded. Regardless, [QUIZ] makes obvious good sense.

IMO, the quiz certainly does not need its own list.

13

I just finished a hunt back through the last several quizzes and they do seem to be threaded quite well. So good in fact, that I doubt a new rule is going to change anything.

Warren are you using a threading MUA?

James Edward Gray II

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 6:14 PM, Stephen Waits wrote:

James Edward Gray II wrote:

If the traffic is bothering people, we could also consider moving Ruby Quiz to it's own mailing list. Do speak up, if we're bugging you...

It's already threaded quite nicely. I can recall one instance, in Quiz 60, where someone posted out of thread, and that was for a new solution.

14

I'm not clear on what you are asking me for here. You want the [QUIZ] rule and no [SOLUTION] rule? Do I have that right?

James Edward Gray II

···

On Jan 6, 2006, at 8:33 PM, James Britt wrote:

James Edward Gray II wrote:

On Jan 3, 2006, at 4:23 PM, Warren Brown wrote:

    If we want to get really bold, the rule could also ask people
submitting solutions to start the subject with "[QUIZ][SOLUTION]" :o)

Yuck. :slight_smile:
[SOLUTION] implies [QUIZ], I think, so we can drop the repatition.

Well, no.

People have used SOLUTION for, well, solutions, for all sorts of problems that they have asked of the list.

I've begun sorting certain topics into separate directories to reduce the traffic in my main ruby-talk folder. Having all QUIZ related items contain QUIZ in the subject makes it pretty clear, as opposed to assuming that people will only post solutions to quizzes.

15

Personally don't care. More importantly is that people reply to the original thread. Keeping it under one (or two, ...) thread(s) is more than adequate.

So, I guess I'm a +0

--Steve

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 7:48 PM, James Edward Gray II wrote:

Let me here a few more opinions on the [QUIZ] rule, and I'll add it if that seems a popular request...

16

Justin Bishop <jubishop@gmail.com> writes:

I agree. using [SOLUTION] by itself makes sense.

I like the idea of extending this concept further. Is it already a
"recommendation" that new software announcements (or updates) have
[ANN] in their subject line?

How about [QUESTION] for people looking for programming help, as well? ;o)

... and then we can have [ANSWER] for the responses, not to mention
other things like [SUGGESTION], [RANT], [LANGUAGE-WAR], etc. And since
[OT] is already in use, for the sake of parity, we should also have
[ON-TOPIC]. :slight_smile:

···

--
Lloyd Zusman
ljz@asfast.com
God bless you.

17

James Edward Gray II wrote:

I'm not clear on what you are asking me for here. You want the [QUIZ] rule and no [SOLUTION] rule? Do I have that right?

I'm saying that [SOLUTION] by itself does not imply [QUIZ]; all quiz-related posts (initial quiz details, questions about the quiz in particular or quizzes in general, solutions t quizzes, etc.) should have QUIZ in the subject.

Adding SOLUTION to that subject line (i.e. [QUIZ SOLUTION]) would then make it clearer for folks who do not want to inadvertently read a proposed quiz solution, while not assuming that all solutions posted to the list revolve around quizzes.

(In general, though, I'm not enamored of "rules"; it's more a matter of a general etiquette suggestion. [SOLUTION] is pretty general, has been used in the past for various posts, and should not be conflated with any particular sub-topic. )

Thanks,

James Britt

···

--

http://www.ruby-doc.org - Ruby Help & Documentation
Ruby Code & Style - Ruby Code & Style: Writers wanted
http://www.rubystuff.com - The Ruby Store for Ruby Stuff
http://www.jamesbritt.com - Playing with Better Toys
http://www.30secondrule.com - Building Better Tools

18

Stephen Waits schrieb:

Let me here a few more opinions on the [QUIZ] rule, and I'll add it if that seems a popular request...

Personally don't care. More importantly is that people reply to the original thread. Keeping it under one (or two, ...) thread(s) is more than adequate.

So, I guess I'm a +0

--Steve

Hello,
Don't make a new rule for that.

I mean the quiz master or James Edward Gray II (may I abbr you in my next messages?) start a thread here for people to reply on that. It has to be common sense to use the given structures.
I personally filter all mails with [QUIZ] in a folder and view them threaded, ordered by subject. This just works fine.
Besides [QUIZ], there is only [ANN] and [RAILS] I think.
I would like to have more tags, but that means all people have to use them too and that won't happen.

Just imagin a list where all ppl use a set of maybe 20 tags like [REGEXP], [TOOLKIT], [HTTPD] and so on :>
That would be so nice, but never happening.

···

On Jan 3, 2006, at 7:48 PM, James Edward Gray II wrote:

-
With kind regards from Germany.

19

We already have a few established tags which people DO use and nobody
seems to be averse towards. [ANN], [RAILS], and [QUIZ]. so it seems
like the only argument is over exactly how many there should be...not
whether we should have them at all. so i don't see why a suggestion to
add _2_ more should be mocked as the equivalent of saying we make a
specific tag for everything under the sun....we have 3 already. i
suggested we have a whopping 5! watch out--i'm crrrrrrazy!

i respect the logical arguments to stick with just the 3 and that's
fine but that's no reason to act like one or two more is completely
outlandish.

···

On 1/4/06, Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> wrote:

Justin Bishop <jubishop@gmail.com> writes:

> I agree. using [SOLUTION] by itself makes sense.
>
> I like the idea of extending this concept further. Is it already a
> "recommendation" that new software announcements (or updates) have
> [ANN] in their subject line?
>
> How about [QUESTION] for people looking for programming help, as well? ;o)

... and then we can have [ANSWER] for the responses, not to mention
other things like [SUGGESTION], [RANT], [LANGUAGE-WAR], etc. And since
[OT] is already in use, for the sake of parity, we should also have
[ON-TOPIC]. :slight_smile:

--
Lloyd Zusman
ljz@asfast.com
God bless you.

20

. . . or we could use [OT] for that, too, but it's a *different* [OT]
than the [OT] used for off-topic stuff. Really it is.

···

On Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 07:39:32AM +0900, Lloyd Zusman wrote:

Justin Bishop <jubishop@gmail.com> writes:

> I agree. using [SOLUTION] by itself makes sense.
>
> I like the idea of extending this concept further. Is it already a
> "recommendation" that new software announcements (or updates) have
> [ANN] in their subject line?
>
> How about [QUESTION] for people looking for programming help, as well? ;o)

... and then we can have [ANSWER] for the responses, not to mention
other things like [SUGGESTION], [RANT], [LANGUAGE-WAR], etc. And since
[OT] is already in use, for the sake of parity, we should also have
[ON-TOPIC]. :slight_smile:

--
Chad Perrin [ CCD CopyWrite | http://ccd.apotheon.org ]

unix virus: If you're using a unixlike OS, please forward
this to 20 others and erase your system partition.