OT: apple x11

just in case anyone missed the word on the wire, apple has released its
version of the X11 software for mac os x, with SDK. it has many
improvements over XDarwin and unlike Tenon XTools et al, it’s free and
of course integrated with default mac system 2D/3D graphics.

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on Macintosh
OS X. this also opens up more possibilities for ruby and accelerated
graphics on mac os x.

brennan

Brennan Leathers wrote:

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on Macintosh
OS X.

FOX (the C++ library) already works OK on Mac OS X with XDarwin,
although perhaps the performance will be better with Apple’s X server
implementation. For some notes about building FOX under Mac OS X, I’d
refer you to this page:

 http://www.fifthplanet.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Mac_OS_X

Alas, the problem we’re seeing with FXRuby doesn’t seem to be related to
X11 at all, but rather some obscure issue related to dynamically loading
the FXRuby extension module (bundle) at runtime. In other words, the
code compiles and links fine, but when you do:

 require 'fox'

it crashes the Ruby interpreter. I suspect the solution will boil down
to some magical combination of compiler and linker options, but I
haven’t hit on it yet.

Interesting - I’d attended a talk on “Mac OS X for unix users” where the
speaker had said that Apple was discouraging the use of X, and
encouraging instead the porting of various toolkits over to quartz.

martin

···

Brennan Leathers digibren@mac.com wrote:

just in case anyone missed the word on the wire, apple has released its
version of the X11 software for mac os x, with SDK. it has many
improvements over XDarwin and unlike Tenon XTools et al, it’s free and
of course integrated with default mac system 2D/3D graphics.

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

cheers,

···

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 09:31:22 +0900, Brennan Leathers wrote:

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on Macintosh
OS X. this also opens up more possibilities for ruby and accelerated
graphics on mac os x.


FUJIMOTO Hisakuni

FUJIMOTO Hisakuni wrote:

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

Wow. Is this running on Mac OS X, or were you running on Linux and
displaying to the X server on the Mac? If it’s actually running on the
Mac, did you have to do anything special to get FXRuby working? That has
been a problem so far…

in the long run, I think he is right. hence Gtk and wxPython’s ports to
Aqua. but in the meantime it helps in the “Switch from Windows”
campaign because it encourages more use of fink apps, openoffice, etc.

it’s also a way to convert more unix users over to apple’s unix, which
in turn hopefully gets Mac OS X Server and xserves installed.

brennan

···

On Thursday, January 9, 2003, at 05:36 AM, Martin DeMello wrote:

Interesting - I’d attended a talk on “Mac OS X for unix users” where
the
speaker had said that Apple was discouraging the use of X, and
encouraging instead the porting of various toolkits over to quartz.

A little bit off topic in this off-topic thread :wink:
I installed Apple’s X11 and then tried to install fink. When I then chose
package system-xfree86 to indicate manually installed X11, I had an error in
dpkb (something about preinstall script). Does anyone have a suggestion how
to configure fink properly to recognize Apple’s X11 implementation?

(What I did to eventually make fink work was to remove /etc/X11 and
/usr/X11R6, install xfree86-base with fink, and then install Apple’s X11
package on top of it again. However, I am not sure it is the best way to do
the job).

Gennady.

···

----- Original Message -----
From: “FUJIMOTO Hisakuni” hisa@imasy.or.jp
To: “ruby-talk ML” ruby-talk@ruby-lang.org
Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 4:12 AM
Subject: Re: OT: apple x11

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 09:31:22 +0900, > Brennan Leathers wrote:

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on Macintosh
OS X. this also opens up more possibilities for ruby and accelerated
graphics on mac os x.

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

cheers,

FUJIMOTO Hisakuni

There are no X11 clients which is running on any remote computer.
Everything was just running on Mac OS X!
freeride, FXRuby or FOX were unstable a little.

X11 server: X11 for Mac OS X
FOX : fox-1.0.29 (built from tarball)
FXScintilla: fxscintilla-1.49.1 (built from tarball)
Ruby: ruby-1.6.7 (included in Mac OS X)
FXRuby: FXRuby-1.0.17 (built from tarball)
FreeRIDE: from cvs server
RubyCocoa:

To build FXRuby with ruby-1.6.7,
a patch for ‘/usr/lib/ruby/1.6/powerpc-darwin6.0/intern.h’
was required as follows:

— intern.h.orig Tue Jul 16 08:17:20 2002
+++ intern.h Thu Jan 9 19:44:22 2003
@@ -192,3 +192,3 @@
void rb_gc_mark_maybe();
-void rb_gc_mark();
+void rb_gc_mark _((VALUE));
void rb_gc_force_recycle _((VALUE));

This patch is not required for 1.6.8 or 1.8, maybe.

cheers,

···

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 22:57:17 +0900, Lyle Johnson wrote:

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

Wow. Is this running on Mac OS X, or were you running on Linux and
displaying to the X server on the Mac? If it’s actually running on the
Mac, did you have to do anything special to get FXRuby working? That has
been a problem so far…


FUJIMOTO Hisakuni

assuming you’ve done fink selfupdate-cvs and you’ve done the proper
upgrade path from the start, just remove previous /usr/X11R6 , delete
your ~/.xinitrc , and then do the source install of system-xfree86.

worked for me, they even updated it so fink tells you that it does
indeed recognize your installation as apple’s. you have to have both
the SDK and the X11 app installed beforehand for it to work.

brennan

···

On Thursday, January 9, 2003, at 11:03 AM, Gennady wrote:

(What I did to eventually make fink work was to remove /etc/X11 and
/usr/X11R6, install xfree86-base with fink, and then install Apple’s
X11
package on top of it again. However, I am not sure it is the best way
to do
the job).

I think you need to make sure you are using the latest package list from
cvs. Here’s what worked for me. (after I removed the fink X11 packages):

fink selfupdate-cvs

[install Apple’s X11 stuff]

fink install system-xfree86

You get a nice little message like “Found the Apple X11 dist. Have a
nice day” or something close to that.

  • Firoze

Gennady wrote:

···

A little bit off topic in this off-topic thread :wink:
I installed Apple’s X11 and then tried to install fink. When I then chose
package system-xfree86 to indicate manually installed X11, I had an
error in
dpkb (something about preinstall script). Does anyone have a
suggestion how
to configure fink properly to recognize Apple’s X11 implementation?

(What I did to eventually make fink work was to remove /etc/X11 and
/usr/X11R6, install xfree86-base with fink, and then install Apple’s X11
package on top of it again. However, I am not sure it is the best way
to do
the job).

Gennady.

----- Original Message -----
From: “FUJIMOTO Hisakuni”
To: “ruby-talk ML”
Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 4:12 AM
Subject: Re: OT: apple x11

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 09:31:22 +0900, > >Brennan Leathers wrote:

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on Macintosh
OS X. this also opens up more possibilities for ruby and accelerated
graphics on mac os x.

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

cheers,

FUJIMOTO Hisakuni

I think you need to make sure you are using the latest package list from
cvs. Here’s what worked for me. (after I removed the fink X11 packages):

fink selfupdate-cvs

[install Apple’s X11 stuff]

fink install system-xfree86

You get a nice little message like “Found the Apple X11 dist. Have a
nice day” or something close to that.

Hope that works for you.

  • Firoze

Gennady wrote:

···

A little bit off topic in this off-topic thread :wink:
I installed Apple’s X11 and then tried to install fink. When I then chose
package system-xfree86 to indicate manually installed X11, I had an
error in
dpkb (something about preinstall script). Does anyone have a
suggestion how
to configure fink properly to recognize Apple’s X11 implementation?

(What I did to eventually make fink work was to remove /etc/X11 and
/usr/X11R6, install xfree86-base with fink, and then install Apple’s X11
package on top of it again. However, I am not sure it is the best way
to do
the job).

Gennady.

----- Original Message -----
From: “FUJIMOTO Hisakuni”
To: “ruby-talk ML”
Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 4:12 AM
Subject: Re: OT: apple x11

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 09:31:22 +0900, > >Brennan Leathers wrote:

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on Macintosh
OS X. this also opens up more possibilities for ruby and accelerated
graphics on mac os x.

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

cheers,

FUJIMOTO Hisakuni

Was this the X11 on Mac OS X 10.2.3 or Oboro?

···

On Thursday, 9 January 2003 at 23:57:25 +0900, FUJIMOTO Hisakuni wrote:

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 22:57:17 +0900, > Lyle Johnson wrote:

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

Wow. Is this running on Mac OS X, or were you running on Linux and
displaying to the X server on the Mac? If it’s actually running on the
Mac, did you have to do anything special to get FXRuby working? That has
been a problem so far…

There are no X11 clients which is running on any remote computer.
Everything was just running on Mac OS X!
freeride, FXRuby or FOX were unstable a little.


Jim Freeze

What good is a ticket to the good life, if you can’t find the
entrance?

Thanks a lot !!! I’ll try this in the evening. I did not do “fink
selfupdate-cvs”, that’s seems to be a problem.

Gennady.

···

----- Original Message -----
From: “Brennan Leathers” digibren@mac.com
To: “ruby-talk ML” ruby-talk@ruby-lang.org
Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 8:14 AM
Subject: Re: OT: apple x11

On Thursday, January 9, 2003, at 11:03 AM, Gennady wrote:

(What I did to eventually make fink work was to remove /etc/X11 and
/usr/X11R6, install xfree86-base with fink, and then install Apple’s
X11
package on top of it again. However, I am not sure it is the best way
to do
the job).

assuming you’ve done fink selfupdate-cvs and you’ve done the proper
upgrade path from the start, just remove previous /usr/X11R6 , delete
your ~/.xinitrc , and then do the source install of system-xfree86.

worked for me, they even updated it so fink tells you that it does
indeed recognize your installation as apple’s. you have to have both
the SDK and the X11 app installed beforehand for it to work.

brennan

FUJIMOTO Hisakuni wrote:

There are no X11 clients which is running on any remote computer.
Everything was just running on Mac OS X!

Great! This gives me hope :wink:

freeride, FXRuby or FOX were unstable a little.

OK. If possible, please use the bug reporting facilities for FreeRIDE
and/or FXRuby when possible to report these problems.

X11 server: X11 for Mac OS X
FOX : fox-1.0.29 (built from tarball)
FXScintilla: fxscintilla-1.49.1 (built from tarball)
Ruby: ruby-1.6.7 (included in Mac OS X)
FXRuby: FXRuby-1.0.17 (built from tarball)
FreeRIDE: from cvs server

OK. All of my testing so far has (I think) been on OS X 10.1.x systems,
so I wonder if something has been fixed for 10.2.

Could you please send me the Makefile that was generated for your FXRuby
build? It should still be in your “FXRuby-1.0.17/ext/fox” directory. I
want to compare it to the Makefile that I got for the 10.1 builds and
see if there are any interesting differences. I would hope that we could
get this working under OS X 10.1, for those who haven’t yet updated to 10.2.

Actually, my problem was solved when I installed Apple X11 SDK (there’s
a tiny link to it on their site). And also updated fink to the latest
cvs code.

Thanks to everybody who was helping me in solving this problem.

Gennady

···

On Saturday, Jan 11, 2003, at 12:44 US/Pacific, Firoze Lafeer wrote:

I think you need to make sure you are using the latest package list
from cvs. Here’s what worked for me. (after I removed the fink X11
packages):

fink selfupdate-cvs

[install Apple’s X11 stuff]

fink install system-xfree86

You get a nice little message like “Found the Apple X11 dist. Have a
nice day” or something close to that.

  • Firoze

Gennady wrote:

A little bit off topic in this off-topic thread :wink:
I installed Apple’s X11 and then tried to install fink. When I then
chose
package system-xfree86 to indicate manually installed X11, I had an
error in
dpkb (something about preinstall script). Does anyone have a
suggestion how
to configure fink properly to recognize Apple’s X11 implementation?

(What I did to eventually make fink work was to remove /etc/X11 and
/usr/X11R6, install xfree86-base with fink, and then install Apple’s
X11
package on top of it again. However, I am not sure it is the best way
to do
the job).

Gennady.

----- Original Message -----
From: “FUJIMOTO Hisakuni”
To: “ruby-talk ML”
Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 4:12 AM
Subject: Re: OT: apple x11

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 09:31:22 +0900, >> >Brennan Leathers wrote:

I mention it here because I’ve been wanting to try the FOX toolkit.
maybe it could now be built more easily than with XDarwin on
Macintosh
OS X. this also opens up more possibilities for ruby and accelerated
graphics on mac os x.

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

cheers,

FUJIMOTO Hisakuni

This X11 was downloaded from http://www.apple.com/macosx/x11/.
Then it is running on Mac OS X 10.2.3.
I don’t know what Oboro is.

···

At Fri, 10 Jan 2003 00:05:15 +0900, Jim Freeze wrote:

On Thursday, 9 January 2003 at 23:57:25 +0900, FUJIMOTO Hisakuni wrote:

At Thu, 9 Jan 2003 22:57:17 +0900, > > Lyle Johnson wrote:

I tried FreeRIDE with X11 for Mac OS X. It was unstable a little,
but it worked. Screenshots are here:

http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx.jpg
http://www.imasy.or.jp/~hisa/mac/rubyosx/files/freeride-x11-osx-2.jpg

Wow. Is this running on Mac OS X, or were you running on Linux and
displaying to the X server on the Mac? If it’s actually running on the
Mac, did you have to do anything special to get FXRuby working? That has
been a problem so far…

There are no X11 clients which is running on any remote computer.
Everything was just running on Mac OS X!
freeride, FXRuby or FOX were unstable a little.

Was this the X11 on Mac OS X 10.2.3 or Oboro?


hisa

OK. All of my testing so far has (I think) been on OS X 10.1.x systems,
so I wonder if something has been fixed for 10.2.

Though clear explanation is hard, I feel that RubyCocoa (what I am
developing) have become pretty stable on OS X 10.2 more than 10.1.

Could you please send me the Makefile that was generated for your FXRuby
build? It should still be in your “FXRuby-1.0.17/ext/fox” directory. I

It will be attached to this message.

cheers,

···

At Thu, 09 Jan 2003 09:38:08 -0600, Lyle Johnson wrote:

Hisa

thx for your screens. Oboro is an abbreviation for the oroborusX window
manager for XDarwin, that made X11 apps under Darwin look like cocoa
apps. tenon x tools and some others I believe did the same thing as
apple’s x11 but for cost. apple’s prob is better integrated and
performs better as well.

brennan

···

On Thursday, January 9, 2003, at 10:22 AM, FUJIMOTO Hisakuni wrote:

This X11 was downloaded from http://www.apple.com/macosx/x11/.
Then it is running on Mac OS X 10.2.3.
I don’t know what Oboro is.

All,

I think that FUJIMOTO has cracked this nut.

He placed a wiki page up here:

http://rwiki.jin.gr.jp/cgi-bin/rw-
cgi.rb?cmd=view;name=FreeRIDE+on+X11+for+Mac+OS+X

Which did not look any different than my build except for one thing at
the top of the wiki…he installed the .pkg files for jpeg, png, gif,
tiff, etc. I was using the fink libraries. I uninstalled the fink
libraries and installed these packages and viola…everything worked.
All the FXRuby demos work including scintilla. I just spent a bit of
time and got ripper built too. My goal is to get this over to the
FreeRIDE wiki so folks can follow it. I also have a goal to do all my
FreeRIDE development under OSX.

Thanks to all,

-rich

···

On Saturday, January 11, 2003, at 03:42 PM, FUJIMOTO Hisakuni wrote:

At Thu, 09 Jan 2003 09:38:08 -0600, > Lyle Johnson wrote:

OK. All of my testing so far has (I think) been on OS X 10.1.x
systems,
so I wonder if something has been fixed for 10.2.

Though clear explanation is hard, I feel that RubyCocoa (what I am
developing) have become pretty stable on OS X 10.2 more than 10.1.

Could you please send me the Makefile that was generated for your
FXRuby
build? It should still be in your “FXRuby-1.0.17/ext/fox” directory. I

It will be attached to this message.

cheers,

Hisa

SHELL = /bin/sh

Start of system configuration section.

srcdir = /Users/hisa/src/ruby/FXRuby-1.0.17/ext/fox
topdir = $(rubylibdir)/$(arch)
hdrdir = $(rubylibdir)/$(arch)
VPATH = $(srcdir)

CC = gcc

CFLAGS = -fno-common -g -Os -pipe -no-cpp-precomp -pipe -pipe
-no-precomp -O0 -Iinclude -DWITH_FXSCINTILLA
CPPFLAGS = -I. -I$(hdrdir) -I$(srcdir) -I$(prefix)/include
-DHAVE_SYS_TIME_H -DHAVE_SIGNAL_H -I/usr/local/include/fxscintilla
-I/usr/local/include/fox
CXXFLAGS = $(CFLAGS)
DLDFLAGS = -L/usr/local/lib -L/usr/X11R6/lib -L$(rubylibdir)/$(arch)
-L$(exec_prefix)/lib
LDSHARED = cc -dynamic -bundle -undefined suppress -flat_namespace
LIBPATH =

RUBY_INSTALL_NAME = ruby
RUBY_SO_NAME =
arch = powerpc-darwin6.0
ruby_version = 1.6

prefix = $(DESTDIR)/usr
exec_prefix = $(prefix)
libdir = $(exec_prefix)/lib
rubylibdir = $(libdir)/ruby/$(ruby_version)
archdir = $(rubylibdir)/$(arch)
sitedir = $(prefix)/lib/ruby/site_ruby
sitelibdir = $(sitedir)/$(ruby_version)
sitearchdir = $(sitelibdir)/$(arch)
target_prefix =

End of system configuration section.

LOCAL_LIBS =
LIBS = $(LIBRUBY_A) -lfxscintilla -lFOX -lGLU -lGL -lX11 -lXext -ltiff
-ljpeg -lz -lstdc++
OBJS = librb.o core_wrap.o dialogs_wrap.o FXRbApp.o FXRbDataTarget.o
FXRuby.o icons_wrap.o image_wrap.o impl.o layout_wrap.o markfuncs.o
mdi_wrap.o opengl_wrap.o scintilla_wrap.o ui_wrap.o

TARGET = fox
DLLIB = $(TARGET).bundle

RUBY = ruby
RM = $(RUBY) -rftools -e
“File::rm_f(*ARGV.map{|x|Dir}.flatten.uniq)”

EXEEXT =

all: $(DLLIB)

clean:; @$(RM) *.o *.so *.sl *.a $(DLLIB)
@$(RM) $(TARGET).lib $(TARGET).exp $(TARGET).ilk *.pdb $(CLEANFILES)

distclean: clean
@$(RM) Makefile extconf.h conftest.* mkmf.log
@$(RM) core ruby$(EXEEXT) *~ $(DISTCLEANFILES)

realclean: distclean

install: $(archdir)$(target_prefix)/$(DLLIB)

site-install: $(sitearchdir)$(target_prefix)/$(DLLIB)

$(archdir)$(target_prefix)/$(DLLIB): $(DLLIB)
@$(RUBY) -r ftools -e ‘File::makedirs(*ARGV)’ $(rubylibdir)
$(archdir)$(target_prefix)
@$(RUBY) -r ftools -e ‘File::install(ARGV[0], ARGV[1], 0555, true)’
$(DLLIB) $(archdir)$(target_prefix)/$(DLLIB)

$(sitearchdir)$(target_prefix)/$(DLLIB): $(DLLIB)
@$(RUBY) -r ftools -e ‘File::makedirs(*ARGV)’
$(sitearchdir)$(target_prefix)
@$(RUBY) -r ftools -e ‘File::install(ARGV[0], ARGV[1], 0555, true)’
$(DLLIB) $(sitearchdir)$(target_prefix)/$(DLLIB)

…c.o:
$(CC) $(CFLAGS) $(CPPFLAGS) -c -o $@ $<

…cc.o:
$(CXX) $(CXXFLAGS) $(CPPFLAGS) -c -o $@ $<
…cpp.o:
$(CXX) $(CXXFLAGS) $(CPPFLAGS) -c -o $@ $<
…cxx.o:
$(CXX) $(CXXFLAGS) $(CPPFLAGS) -c -o $@ $<
…C.o:
$(CXX) $(CXXFLAGS) $(CPPFLAGS) -c -o $@ $<
$(DLLIB): $(OBJS)
$(LDSHARED) $(DLDFLAGS) -o $(DLLIB) $(OBJS) $(LIBS) $(LOCAL_LIBS)

The default window manager of X11 for Mac OS X is quartz-wm.

thanks,

···

At Fri, 10 Jan 2003 00:40:23 +0900, Brennan Leathers wrote:

This X11 was downloaded from http://www.apple.com/macosx/x11/.
Then it is running on Mac OS X 10.2.3.
I don’t know what Oboro is.

thx for your screens. Oboro is an abbreviation for the oroborusX window
manager for XDarwin, that made X11 apps under Darwin look like cocoa
apps. tenon x tools and some others I believe did the same thing as
apple’s x11 but for cost. apple’s prob is better integrated and
performs better as well.


Hisa