Abe Vionas_MailingList wrote:
What it comes down to is what it's coming down to
for me...
platform maturity.
Python on windows has a broad range of libraries
available for anything you could ever dream of:
Apache, Java, Email, Protocols, GTK, Qt, Tk,
OpenGL, PostgreSQL,
MySQL, etc etc etc. As far as Python
library availability for Linux, I really don't
know, as I was
only looking for windows stuff last night. My
feeling is that
while not being quite as comprehensive as it's
windows offerings
it still offers a good depth.
Ruby, on the other hand, while it has a
comprehensive offering on
the Linux platform, is hamstrung on
windows by it's lack in important areas. If
libraries exist, they
more often then not are NOT being actively
maintained (my
research last night indicated that by and large
more Python
libraries are continually actively maintained).
This last point
is important
because at one time or another Ruby has HAD
libraries to cover
any need, but without active maintenance they are
nearly
worthless. I for one will not even look at a
library that hasn't
had a release in 2004.
Binary releases are sometimes a problem, most of us
are unix users,
there are some windows users. I think a few need to
get together
and compile windows binaries. Hopefully, I will be
able to continue
to have access to a win2k machine and compile much
for the RPA ruby
packaging system. Sorry it didnt work out for you. I
will be having
a GUI for RPA soon. I'm the type of person who does
think about
Windows users and GUIs for the people who might not
know typical
compiling routines. Some linuxes just have a
packaging system for
them to do it for them, I have BSD. I know its not
easy on windows,
I will get some effort into helping RPA witht he GUI
and compiling
windows binaries.
What exactly are you needing? What type of developer
are you? and
What are the type of modules do you regularly use on
Windows?
I'm not a frequent windows developer, but I do know
a great deal
about Windows programming. Effort to solve the
Windows area is
underway.
I'm a relatively "simple" developer, but I do want to
be able to do web work with Ruby without having to use
a framework, even though there are some excellent
frameworks out there. For me the really important
modules are GUI, web (not frameworks, they're being
very comprehensively developed), databases (in
particular the open source databases), windows API,
and as a side interest graphics/SWF/etc.
So, this is what it comes down to for me... Which
language offers what I need in terms of libraries?
I decided to
go looking after having an excrutiating time
finding just Ruby
FastCGI, mod_ruby, and PostgreSQL libraries which
would actually
work on Windows - forget being maintained at all.
No luck
though. Even a post to the Ruby-Talk list asking
for help with an
attempt to install FastCGI for Ruby yielded only
one reply.
I seen your question, I didn't know the answer
though. Did you try
the maintainer?
I didn't. I suppose I thought if only one person
replied on the list I wouldn't fair as well with the
maintainer either.
Finally, while the Ruby Gem system is exceptionally
easy to work with and a real boon to Ruby, it
doesn't quite match
the ease of installing ANY given Python library.
Every Python
windows library for the most part comes with a
windows installer
(exe or msi).
Would you rather have a GUI, and/or executables
which can be
installed? hmm thoughts for RPA
Well, the Ruby Gem system is excellent as I mentioned
before, the primary issue is with those packages
released without a Gem. At least for me that's where
it can get hairy. A Ruby Gem GUI would simply be an
improvement on an already outstanding utility. I
suppose this requires some focus by and on behalf of
Windows Ruby developers. I'm simply too much of a newb
to be much good as a leader in such an area at this
time.
Keep in mind that it may be more doable to run Ruby
on windows
given substantial C programming/compiling
experience, I don't
know. Obviously, if I had the
experience to satisfy that statement I would be
able to answer my
own question. : -)
No problem. What problems were you having, besides
fastcgi, and I
can look in to it on my spare time.
I'd certainly appreciate it! Mostly I experienced a
great deal of frustration with trying to get the
Ruby-->Apache link established (couldn't find an
applicable, functioning package), and secondly, I
couldn't find a Ruby-->PostgreSQL which seemed to be
actively maintained. Those that I found seemed like
they'd be stable, but wouldn't be current with newer
releases of PostgreSQL.
So, for those of us who aren't C gurus and don't
run Linux,
Python seems to win out when compared to Ruby.
Which is
unfortunate because I really love Ruby, and don't
like a number
of Python elements. However,
having the capabilities I need is much more
important than syntax
preferences at the moment.
Sadly, in order for Ruby to really take over the
world it will
require a more substantial focus on providing
windows compatible
libraries and maintaining those libraries. If Ruby
continues to
be a Linux-centric
language... I don't know. It just seems to me
fairly obvious that
in order to have true dominance you have to meet
the needs of the
major platforms. Python does this moreso then Ruby.
And believe
me, I wish it were the other way around.
please use the term, unix-centric. I'm a BSDuser
Thanks.
Of course, did I say Linux? I meant Unix. : -)
Also, I agree, Ruby is more towards unix, some of
the developers
dislike programming on windows, not mentioning any
names but he
knows who he is :). Its not so much that libraries
are unix-
centric, but someone needs to compile the libraries
on Windows.
Most libraries already work well with windows, but
its a compiling
issue.
I've noticed this. It's really unfortunate because in
a case like this the only way to beat them is to join
them (windows people). Help us bridge the gap between
windows and unix (or whatever) and windows will loose
it's dominance. Yep, the compiling complications are
overwhelming to someone as inexperienced with such as
myself.
I appreciate your offer of help, and I'd be more than
enthused to get my hands on a functioning, current
module for ruby-apache2, ruby-postgresql.
Regards, Abe
ยทยทยท
On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 23:29:29 +0900, David Ross wrote:
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