The real Ruby vs. Python

Abe Vionas_MailingList wrote:

What it comes down to is what it's coming down to

for me...

platform maturity.

Python on windows has a broad range of libraries
available for anything you could ever dream of:
Apache, Java, Email, Protocols, GTK, Qt, Tk,

OpenGL, PostgreSQL,

MySQL, etc etc etc. As far as Python
library availability for Linux, I really don't

know, as I was

only looking for windows stuff last night. My

feeling is that

while not being quite as comprehensive as it's

windows offerings

it still offers a good depth.

Ruby, on the other hand, while it has a

comprehensive offering on

the Linux platform, is hamstrung on
windows by it's lack in important areas. If

libraries exist, they

more often then not are NOT being actively

maintained (my

research last night indicated that by and large

more Python

libraries are continually actively maintained).

This last point

is important
because at one time or another Ruby has HAD

libraries to cover

any need, but without active maintenance they are

nearly

worthless. I for one will not even look at a

library that hasn't

had a release in 2004.

Binary releases are sometimes a problem, most of us

are unix users,

there are some windows users. I think a few need to

get together

and compile windows binaries. Hopefully, I will be

able to continue

to have access to a win2k machine and compile much

for the RPA ruby

packaging system. Sorry it didnt work out for you. I

will be having

a GUI for RPA soon. I'm the type of person who does

think about

Windows users and GUIs for the people who might not

know typical

compiling routines. Some linuxes just have a

packaging system for

them to do it for them, I have BSD. I know its not

easy on windows,

I will get some effort into helping RPA witht he GUI

and compiling

windows binaries.

What exactly are you needing? What type of developer

are you? and

What are the type of modules do you regularly use on

Windows?

I'm not a frequent windows developer, but I do know

a great deal

about Windows programming. Effort to solve the

Windows area is

underway.

I'm a relatively "simple" developer, but I do want to
be able to do web work with Ruby without having to use
a framework, even though there are some excellent
frameworks out there. For me the really important
modules are GUI, web (not frameworks, they're being
very comprehensively developed), databases (in
particular the open source databases), windows API,
and as a side interest graphics/SWF/etc.

So, this is what it comes down to for me... Which
language offers what I need in terms of libraries?

I decided to

go looking after having an excrutiating time

finding just Ruby

FastCGI, mod_ruby, and PostgreSQL libraries which

would actually

work on Windows - forget being maintained at all.

No luck

though. Even a post to the Ruby-Talk list asking

for help with an

attempt to install FastCGI for Ruby yielded only

one reply.

I seen your question, I didn't know the answer

though. Did you try

the maintainer?

I didn't. I suppose I thought if only one person
replied on the list I wouldn't fair as well with the
maintainer either.

Finally, while the Ruby Gem system is exceptionally
easy to work with and a real boon to Ruby, it

doesn't quite match

the ease of installing ANY given Python library.

Every Python

windows library for the most part comes with a

windows installer

(exe or msi).

Would you rather have a GUI, and/or executables

which can be

installed? hmm thoughts for RPA

Well, the Ruby Gem system is excellent as I mentioned
before, the primary issue is with those packages
released without a Gem. At least for me that's where
it can get hairy. A Ruby Gem GUI would simply be an
improvement on an already outstanding utility. I
suppose this requires some focus by and on behalf of
Windows Ruby developers. I'm simply too much of a newb
to be much good as a leader in such an area at this
time.

Keep in mind that it may be more doable to run Ruby

on windows

given substantial C programming/compiling

experience, I don't

know. Obviously, if I had the
experience to satisfy that statement I would be

able to answer my

own question. : -)

No problem. What problems were you having, besides

fastcgi, and I

can look in to it on my spare time.

I'd certainly appreciate it! Mostly I experienced a
great deal of frustration with trying to get the
Ruby-->Apache link established (couldn't find an
applicable, functioning package), and secondly, I
couldn't find a Ruby-->PostgreSQL which seemed to be
actively maintained. Those that I found seemed like
they'd be stable, but wouldn't be current with newer
releases of PostgreSQL.

So, for those of us who aren't C gurus and don't

run Linux,

Python seems to win out when compared to Ruby.

Which is

unfortunate because I really love Ruby, and don't

like a number

of Python elements. However,
having the capabilities I need is much more

important than syntax

preferences at the moment.

Sadly, in order for Ruby to really take over the

world it will

require a more substantial focus on providing

windows compatible

libraries and maintaining those libraries. If Ruby

continues to

be a Linux-centric
language... I don't know. It just seems to me

fairly obvious that

in order to have true dominance you have to meet

the needs of the

major platforms. Python does this moreso then Ruby.

And believe

me, I wish it were the other way around.

please use the term, unix-centric. I'm a BSDuser :slight_smile:

Thanks.

Of course, did I say Linux? I meant Unix. : -)

Also, I agree, Ruby is more towards unix, some of

the developers

dislike programming on windows, not mentioning any

names but he

knows who he is :). Its not so much that libraries

are unix-

centric, but someone needs to compile the libraries

on Windows.

Most libraries already work well with windows, but

its a compiling

issue.

I've noticed this. It's really unfortunate because in
a case like this the only way to beat them is to join
them (windows people). Help us bridge the gap between
windows and unix (or whatever) and windows will loose
it's dominance. Yep, the compiling complications are
overwhelming to someone as inexperienced with such as
myself.

I appreciate your offer of help, and I'd be more than
enthused to get my hands on a functioning, current
module for ruby-apache2, ruby-postgresql.

Regards, Abe

ยทยทยท

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 23:29:29 +0900, David Ross wrote:

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