Exactly, it's 2013. Flash is dying, unless you've just been living in a
hole for the past few years. Android and iOS dropped it for mobile, what
does that say to you? Now is the era of Javascript frameworks.
Now what was that about not starting an OS war? Not working so well is it?
I gave you fair warning.
Regardless, I suggest we drop such nonsense as this. Sans Windows you'll be
good to go. An OS is as complicated as you want it to be, including Ubuntu.
···
On May 29, 2013 5:21 PM, "Panagiotis Atmatzidis" <atma@convalesco.org> wrote:
--- flame on ---
On 29 Μαϊ 2013, at 20:02 , Chad Perrin <code@apotheon.net> wrote:
> On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 02:54:51AM +0900, Brandon Weaver wrote:
>>
>> Skip FreeBSD and put armored plating on that bike by going OpenBSD.
>
> That's an option, too. I plan to build an OpenBSD router/firewall for
> my network this week -- but I'm still using FreeBSD on my laptop.
>
>
>>
>> Ubuntu I would agree is newbie, but elitism on Linux vs BSD gets no
where
>> fast.
>
> I didn't take any of this as being about "elitism". Maybe I missed
> something.
>
> --
> Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
>
Sure, go ahead... But when you grow up and need just to get the job done
quickly, get a mac (and a life).
j/k
--- flame off ---
Seriously, OpenBSD for learning ruby? You're talking about systems that
don't even have native flash supports and it's 2013...
Panagiotis (atmosx) Atmatzidis
email: atma@convalesco.org
URL: http://www.convalesco.org
GnuPG ID: 0x1A7BFEC5
gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 1A7BFEC5
--
The wise man said: "Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to
their level and beat you with experience."
Is Windows that bad? I learned on Windows. IDK the state of things now,
though.
-Josh
···
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 5:30 PM, Brandon Weaver <keystonelemur@gmail.com>wrote:
Exactly, it's 2013. Flash is dying, unless you've just been living in a
hole for the past few years. Android and iOS dropped it for mobile, what
does that say to you? Now is the era of Javascript frameworks.
Now what was that about not starting an OS war? Not working so well is it?
I gave you fair warning.
Regardless, I suggest we drop such nonsense as this. Sans Windows you'll
be good to go. An OS is as complicated as you want it to be, including
Ubuntu.
Your doing it again in sort of a sandman argument style 'manifest
destiny' argument.
Take a step back and reread the thread. You actually, in sort of in a
megalomaniac fashion, created the warning and then proceeded to ignite
your stated flame war almost so you could state "I told you so".
~Stu
···
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 5:30 PM, Brandon Weaver <keystonelemur@gmail.com> wrote:
Now what was that about not starting an OS war? Not working so well is it? I
gave you fair warning.
It was brought up in conversation in regards to pedagogy in the same
respect that grokking meta-programming concepts and algorithms in
contrast to using predefined higher order methods or external library
gem which may only teach the learner domains but not computational
logic.
By suggesting anything which may provide less "training wheels" per
say I am merely recommending the OP to explore other options when they
are comfortable with these new tools and operating systems.
The idea that the learner has "freedom" to choose how they skin the
cat is essential to their exploratory growth and cognitive development
which will position them to become great programmers if they choose
that as a career.
Finally FreeBSD and DragonFlyBSD both provide an excellent exploratory
environment to learn UNIX proper with minimal hand holding hence
leaving the end user the power to build upon such skills learned
beyond programming paradigms through grokking automata in an agnostic
low-leval/high-level mental process.
You may think that operating system level programming has nothing to
do with ruby but I promise you there are many projects which focus on
using ruby for such things (portupgrade/homebrew/rake). Ruby isn't
just for web programming and is perfectly suitable for shell
programming as well.
~Stu
···
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 3:35 PM, <sto.mar@web.de> wrote:
Am 29.05.2013 20:47, schrieb Stu:
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 1:08 PM, Brandon Weaver <keystonelemur@gmail.com> >> wrote:
I don't see why you would suggest anything "over ubuntu".
Learning to program (or script) with Ruby has nothing to do
with the used operating system or (even less) Linux distro.
Rails and Ruby act oddly in most cases. Rails is an unholy gauntlet of
patching and fixing to get to work properly, at least last time I tried it.
Unix anything I can be deployed in a few minutes.
···
On May 29, 2013 6:29 PM, "Josh Cheek" <josh.cheek@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 5:30 PM, Brandon Weaver <keystonelemur@gmail.com>wrote:
Exactly, it's 2013. Flash is dying, unless you've just been living in a
hole for the past few years. Android and iOS dropped it for mobile, what
does that say to you? Now is the era of Javascript frameworks.
Now what was that about not starting an OS war? Not working so well is
it? I gave you fair warning.
Regardless, I suggest we drop such nonsense as this. Sans Windows you'll
be good to go. An OS is as complicated as you want it to be, including
Ubuntu.
Is Windows that bad? I learned on Windows. IDK the state of things now,
though.
I don't see why you would suggest anything "over ubuntu".
Learning to program (or script) with Ruby has nothing to do
with the used operating system or (even less) Linux distro.
[...]
By suggesting anything which may provide less "training wheels" per
say I am merely recommending the OP to explore other options when they
are comfortable with these new tools and operating systems.
[...]
You may think that operating system level programming has nothing to
do with ruby but I promise you there are many projects which focus on
using ruby for such things (portupgrade/homebrew/rake). Ruby isn't
just for web programming and is perfectly suitable for shell
programming as well.
I'm very well aware of that. I use Ruby extensively for shell
programming under Ubuntu (and I do not use "training wheels").
I am forced to do my teaching on Windows, though, and yet
algorithmically it can (of course) get as complicated as you wish.
I don't see much value in recommending a change of OS (apart
from not using Windows...), especially to a beginner.
As a side note: I wouldn't recommend starting with metaprogramming
before there is a solid basis of Ruby and OO programming fundamentals.
I have seen enquiries about metaprogramming on this list by people
who couldn't even define the most simplest class, which I find
rather alarming...
···
Am 29.05.2013 23:57, schrieb Stu:
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 3:35 PM, <sto.mar@web.de> wrote:
Am 29.05.2013 20:47, schrieb Stu:
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 1:08 PM, Brandon Weaver <keystonelemur@gmail.com> >>> wrote:
In order to write something that writes programming, you kinda need to
understand programming itself. It's the same way with Lisp Macros, you're
out of your mind to try them before you have a firm grasp in the language.
Yes, it's an awesome feature, but notoriously complicated for the
uninitiated.
···
On May 30, 2013 4:08 AM, <sto.mar@web.de> wrote:
Am 29.05.2013 23:57, schrieb Stu:
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 3:35 PM, <sto.mar@web.de> wrote:
Am 29.05.2013 20:47, schrieb Stu:
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 1:08 PM, Brandon Weaver < >>>> keystonelemur@gmail.com> >>>> wrote:
I don't see why you would suggest anything "over ubuntu".
Learning to program (or script) with Ruby has nothing to do
with the used operating system or (even less) Linux distro.
[...]
By suggesting anything which may provide less "training wheels" per
say I am merely recommending the OP to explore other options when they
are comfortable with these new tools and operating systems.
[...]
You may think that operating system level programming has nothing to
do with ruby but I promise you there are many projects which focus on
using ruby for such things (portupgrade/homebrew/rake). Ruby isn't
just for web programming and is perfectly suitable for shell
programming as well.
I'm very well aware of that. I use Ruby extensively for shell
programming under Ubuntu (and I do not use "training wheels").
I am forced to do my teaching on Windows, though, and yet
algorithmically it can (of course) get as complicated as you wish.
I don't see much value in recommending a change of OS (apart
from not using Windows...), especially to a beginner.
As a side note: I wouldn't recommend starting with metaprogramming
before there is a solid basis of Ruby and OO programming fundamentals.
I have seen enquiries about metaprogramming on this list by people
who couldn't even define the most simplest class, which I find
rather alarming...
