# Who maintains ruby-talk? **URL:** \ **Category:** ruby-talk\ **Created:** [14 April 2010 07:39 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146 "2010-04-14T07:39:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tony\_Arcieri4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c77e96/32.png) [@Tony\_Arcieri4](https://rubytalk.org/u/Tony_Arcieri4)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 07:39 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/1 "2010-04-14T07:39:10Z")
Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. Is there actually a person in charge of ruby-talk? > **···** > > -- > Tony Arcieri > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand ---
**Author:** ![Brian\_Candler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Brian\_Candler](https://rubytalk.org/u/Brian_Candler)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 08:44 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/2 "2010-04-14T08:44:01Z")
Tony Arcieri wrote: > Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security > vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. > > Is there actually a person in charge of ruby-talk? There are admin contact addresses here: [http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions/](http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions/) (While you're at it, you could ask for the broken link at the bottom of [http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/](http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/) which is supposed to point to "the manual way" to be fixed) > **···** > > -- > Posted via [http://www.ruby-forum.com/\](http://www.ruby-forum.com/%5C). ---
**Author:** ![Robert\_K1](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/rubytalk.org/robert_k1/32/1830_2.png) [@Robert\_K1](https://rubytalk.org/u/Robert_K1)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 12:21 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/3 "2010-04-14T12:21:50Z")
Did you just suggest that ruby-talk should become a moderated list? Kind regards robert > **···** > > 2010/4/14 Tony Arcieri \: > > > Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security > > vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. > > -- > remember.guy do |as, often| as.you\_can - without end > [http://blog.rubybestpractices.com/](http://blog.rubybestpractices.com/) ---
**Author:** ![Michael\_J\_I\_Jackson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Michael\_J\_I\_Jackson](https://rubytalk.org/u/Michael_J_I_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 14:30 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/4 "2010-04-14T14:30:38Z")
Just last week I was having problems managing my subscription via the list controller. When I tried the "manual way" ([http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions/\](http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions/%5C)) I couldn't get the bot to respond either. As a last resort I emailed the human administrator address (ruby-talk-admin@ruby-lang.org) and got a response from Matz himself. Perhaps that's the problem. The list is being maintained by a person who most assuredly doesn't have time for it because he has much more important things to do! Michael > **···** > > -- > Michael Jackson > > > **[WebMD - Better information. Better health.](http://mjijackson.com/)** > > > > The leading source for trustworthy and timely health and medical news and information. Providing credible health information, supportive community, and educational services by blending award-winning expertise in content, community services, expert... > > @mjijackson > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:39 AM, Tony Arcieri \ wrote: > > > Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security > > vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. > > > > Is there actually a person in charge of ruby-talk? > > > > -- > > Tony Arcieri > > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand ---
**Author:** ![Rich\_McGrath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@Rich\_McGrath](https://rubytalk.org/u/Rich_McGrath)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 14:32 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/5 "2010-04-14T14:32:03Z")
Maybe this mailing list might be better suited in a forum. > **···** > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 10:30 AM, Michael Jackson \wrote: > > > Just last week I was having problems managing my subscription via the > > list controller. When I tried the "manual way" > > ([http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions/\](http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions/%5C)) > > I couldn't get the bot to respond either. As a last resort I emailed > > the human administrator address (ruby-talk-admin@ruby-lang.org) and > > got a response from Matz himself. > > > > Perhaps that's the problem. The list is being maintained by a person > > who most assuredly doesn't have time for it because he has much more > > important things to do! > > > > Michael > > > > -- > > Michael Jackson > > [http://mjijackson.com/](http://mjijackson.com/) > > @mjijackson > > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:39 AM, Tony Arcieri \ \> wrote: > > \> Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security > > \> vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. > > \> > > \> Is there actually a person in charge of ruby-talk? > > \> > > \> -- > > \> Tony Arcieri > > \> Medioh! A Kudelski Brand > > \> > > -- > Rich McGrath > Tech Lead for Bitmob.com > rich.mcgrath@bitmob.com > [www.Bitmob.com](http://www.Bitmob.com) > [www.twitter.com/Bitmobrich](http://www.twitter.com/Bitmobrich) ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Arcieri4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c77e96/32.png) [@Tony\_Arcieri4](https://rubytalk.org/u/Tony_Arcieri4)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 14:52 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/6 "2010-04-14T14:52:33Z")
Yes, given the recent high volume of off-topic posts, I think it's clear the list is in need of a moderator, at the very least someone who can warn/ban users who make high volumes of off-topic posts. > **···** > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 6:21 AM, Robert Klemme \wrote: > > > Did you just suggest that ruby-talk should become a moderated list? > > -- > Tony Arcieri > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand ---
**Author:** ![Given\_Mahlangeni\_HQP](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Given\_Mahlangeni\_HQP](https://rubytalk.org/u/Given_Mahlangeni_HQP)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 16:31 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/7 "2010-04-14T16:31:22Z")
You should be died, Michael Jackson died long time ago. Given Mahlangeni Technical Support Specialist HQP - Information Management Tel: +27 12 307 3230 Fax: +27 86 665 8050 Mobile: +27 82 732 2755 Email: given.mahlangeni@exxaro.com URL: [www.exxaro.com](http://www.exxaro.com) cid:image001.jpg@01C8F881.97251A80 > **···** > > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael Jackson [mailto:mjijackson@gmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2010 4:31 PM > To: ruby-talk ML > Subject: Re: Who maintains ruby-talk? > > Just last week I was having problems managing my subscription via the > list controller. When I tried the "manual way" > ([http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions](http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/community/mailing-lists/manual-instructions) > /) > I couldn't get the bot to respond either. As a last resort I emailed > the human administrator address (ruby-talk-admin@ruby-lang.org) and > got a response from Matz himself. > > Perhaps that's the problem. The list is being maintained by a person > who most assuredly doesn't have time for it because he has much more > important things to do! > > Michael > > -- > Michael Jackson > > > **[WebMD - Better information. Better health.](http://mjijackson.com/)** > > > > The leading source for trustworthy and timely health and medical news and information. Providing credible health information, supportive community, and educational services by blending award-winning expertise in content, community services, expert... > > @mjijackson > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:39 AM, Tony Arcieri \ wrote: > > > Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security > > vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. > > > > Is there actually a person in charge of ruby-talk? > > > > -- > > Tony Arcieri > > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This e-mail is confidential and is for the addressee only. > Please refer to [http://www.exxaro.com/content/main/disclaimer.asp](http://www.exxaro.com/content/main/disclaimer.asp) for important disclaimers. ---
**Author:** ![Robert\_K1](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/rubytalk.org/robert_k1/32/1830_2.png) [@Robert\_K1](https://rubytalk.org/u/Robert_K1)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 14:36 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/8 "2010-04-14T14:36:19Z")
Well, a mailing list is a forum as well. 🙂 Also, please note this: > **[Who maintains ruby-talk?](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/186915)** > > Among other things, the ruby-talk MLM is rampant with security vulnerabilities, and in need of moderation. Is there actually a person in charge of ruby-talk? 🙂 Cheers robert > **···** > > 2010/4/14 Rich McGrath \: > > > Maybe this mailing list might be better suited in a forum. > > -- > remember.guy do |as, often| as.you\_can - without end > [http://blog.rubybestpractices.com/](http://blog.rubybestpractices.com/) ---
**Author:** ![Josh\_Cheek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e79b87/32.png) [@Josh\_Cheek](https://rubytalk.org/u/Josh_Cheek)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 15:08 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/9 "2010-04-14T15:08:36Z")
You know, the Nazis had moderators, but they made the Jews wear them. Sorry, Office Space 🙂 Unless things got completely unusable, I'd much prefer if there wasn't someone with the power to kick people off the list whenever the whim struck them. Between spam filters and community policing, I think this list is fine. > **···** > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 9:52 AM, Tony Arcieri \wrote: > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 6:21 AM, Robert Klemme \> \wrote: > > > > \> Did you just suggest that ruby-talk should become a moderated list? > > \> > > > > Yes, given the recent high volume of off-topic posts, I think it's clear > > the > > list is in need of a moderator, at the very least someone who can warn/ban > > users who make high volumes of off-topic posts. > > > > -- > > Tony Arcieri > > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand ---
**Author:** ![Aldric\_Giacomoni2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/91b2a8/32.png) [@Aldric\_Giacomoni2](https://rubytalk.org/u/Aldric_Giacomoni2)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 15:16 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/10 "2010-04-14T15:16:34Z")
Tony Arcieri wrote: > **···** > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 6:21 AM, Robert Klemme \> \wrote: > > > > > Did you just suggest that ruby-talk should become a moderated list? > > > > Yes, given the recent high volume of off-topic posts, I think it's clear > > the > > list is in need of a moderator, at the very least someone who can > > warn/ban > > users who make high volumes of off-topic posts. > > Tony, > I need to disagree with you here. This idea makes the hair on my neck > stand on end. > -- > Posted via [http://www.ruby-forum.com/\](http://www.ruby-forum.com/%5C). ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Collins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3e96dc/32.png) [@Justin\_Collins](https://rubytalk.org/u/Justin_Collins)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 22:18 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/11 "2010-04-14T22:18:07Z")
Tony Arcieri wrote: > > Did you just suggest that ruby-talk should become a moderated list? > > Yes, given the recent high volume of off-topic posts, I think it's clear the > list is in need of a moderator, at the very least someone who can warn/ban > users who make high volumes of off-topic posts. I am not even sure moderation is a technical possibility. "ruby-talk" is actually an amalgam of a Google user group, a forum, and a mailing list, all of which are different systems run by different people. Spam is handled decently already. If a thread is off-topic, the community should be able to take care of it or ignore it, letting it die a natural death. -Justin > **···** > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 6:21 AM, Robert Klemme \> \wrote: ---
**Author:** ![Dylan\_Northrup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f475e1/32.png) [@Dylan\_Northrup](https://rubytalk.org/u/Dylan_Northrup)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 16:06 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/12 "2010-04-14T16:06:14Z")
A long time ago, (15.04.10), in a galaxy far, far away, Josh Cheek wrote: :=Unless things got completely unusable, I'd much prefer if there wasn't :=someone with the power to kick people off the list whenever the whim struck :=them. Between spam filters and community policing, I think this list is :=fine. It's gotten to an unusable space for me. I regularly delete all messages after scanning the subjects without reading them. Up until approximately a month ago I would actually read the majority of the posts to see what is posted as well as learn from example code posted by others. But given the recent spate of off-topic garbage the list has pretty much become unusable. I'm hopeful that something will change and the spammers/off-topic posts will go elsewhere, but would very much appreciate being able to have someone step in to stop the madness. > **···** > > -- > Dylan Northrup - [docx@io.com](mailto:docx@io.com) - [http://www.io.com/~docx/](http://www.io.com/~docx/) > "Adversity is just change that we haven't adapted ourselves to yet." >     - Aimee Mullins ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Arcieri4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c77e96/32.png) [@Tony\_Arcieri4](https://rubytalk.org/u/Tony_Arcieri4)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 16:15 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/13 "2010-04-14T16:15:10Z")
For what it's worth, I've considered unsubscribing due to the high volume of off-topic email. > **···** > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 9:08 AM, Josh Cheek \ wrote: > > > Unless things got completely unusable, I'd much prefer if there wasn't > > someone with the power to kick people off the list > > -- > Tony Arcieri > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand ---
**Author:** ![Seebs1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e99b99/32.png) [@Seebs1](https://rubytalk.org/u/Seebs1)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 17:20 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/14 "2010-04-14T17:20:09Z")
Remember to distinguish between "power" and "authority". Right now, someone, somewhere, has the power to kick people off the list. The list runs somewhere; someone has the keys to that computer, and can modify anything on it. Realistically, you can either have some kind of moderation, or offer a free spam reflector service complete with malware delivery. I'd recommend the former. -s > **···** > > On 2010-04-14, Josh Cheek \ wrote: > > > Unless things got completely unusable, I'd much prefer if there wasn't > > someone with the power to kick people off the list whenever the whim struck > > them. Between spam filters and community policing, I think this list is > > fine. > > -- > Copyright 2010, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / usenet-nospam@seebs.net > [| Seebs.Net](http://www.seebs.net/log/) \<-- lawsuits, religion, and funny pictures > [Fair game (Scientology) - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_Game_(Scientology)) \<-- get educated! ---
**Author:** ![7rans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/7/a8b319/32.png) [@7rans](https://rubytalk.org/u/7rans)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 19:06 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/15 "2010-04-14T19:06:07Z")
And there is the Google Group as well. Pretty much puts all the worry about garbage in your inbox to rest. Of course, if your heart is set on using your inbox, then the trick is to black list people like thunk --of course then you'll miss it when thunk actually says something useful... well maybe not, but you get the point. I setup the Google Group archive, and I can black list people at that end if I want, I have never done so (expect obvious spam). I almost did so for thunk however. But in the end I decided just to give it a few days, and as usually the noise eventually died down. > **···** > > On Apr 14, 10:36 am, Robert Klemme \ wrote: > > > 2010/4/14 Rich McGrath \: > > > > \> Maybe this mailing list might be better suited in a forum. > > > > Well, a mailing list is a forum as well. 🙂 > > > > Also, please note this:[Who maintains ruby-talk? - Ruby - Ruby-Forum](http://www.ruby-forum.com/topic/207947#905025) ---
**Author:** ![James\_Britt3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b782af/32.png) [@James\_Britt3](https://rubytalk.org/u/James_Britt3)\ **Post date:** [15 April 2010 00:08 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/16 "2010-04-15T00:08:53Z")
Justin Collins wrote: > I am not even sure moderation is a technical possibility. "ruby-talk" is actually an amalgam of a Google user group, a forum, and a mailing list, all of which are different systems run by different people. > > Spam is handled decently already. If a thread is off-topic, the community should be able to take care of it or ignore it, letting it die a natural death. Exactly correct. My off-the-top-of-my recollection of annoying threads is that a good deal of the longevity rests with people who continue to engage the original poster. If some proposed moderator is going to ban people responsible for junk postings, will they also boot people who feed the trolls? They're responsible for the noise problem as well. Rather than try to change the behavior of trolls and such (you won't, so don't bother), how about reserving that ire for the people who encourage them? > **···** > > -- > James Britt > > [www.jamesbritt.com](http://www.jamesbritt.com) - Playing with Better Toys > [www.ruby-doc.org](http://www.ruby-doc.org) - Ruby Help & Documentation > [www.rubystuff.com](http://www.rubystuff.com) - The Ruby Store for Ruby Stuff > [www.neurogami.com](http://www.neurogami.com) - Smart application development ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Arcieri4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c77e96/32.png) [@Tony\_Arcieri4](https://rubytalk.org/u/Tony_Arcieri4)\ **Post date:** [15 April 2010 05:55 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/17 "2010-04-15T05:55:13Z")
As someone who has built a supersyndication system (in Ruby!), I completely do not buy this argument. As far as I am aware, the MLM of ruby-talk@ruby-lang.org is the central authority of the state of the mailing list, and everything else is just syndication. You're arguing that because ruby-talk is syndicated means it's uncontrollable? Bullshit. Unless I'm confused the MLM is the central authority. And, oh by the way, as I referenced in the OP, the MLM is subject to some pretty ridiculous security vulnerabilities. Anyone can unsubscribe anyone from ruby-talk, so long as the read it via e-mail. That's silly. > **···** > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 4:18 PM, Justin Collins \wrote: > > > I am not even sure moderation is a technical possibility. "ruby-talk" is > > actually an amalgam of a Google user group, a forum, and a mailing list, all > > of which are different systems run by different people. > > -- > Tony Arcieri > Medioh! A Kudelski Brand ---
**Author:** ![Josh\_Cheek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e79b87/32.png) [@Josh\_Cheek](https://rubytalk.org/u/Josh_Cheek)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 16:30 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/18 "2010-04-14T16:30:55Z")
Perhaps I've missed something, I thought this was a reaction to Thunk, but he only posts in a few threads. I notice you both have email addresses from hosts I'm not familiar with, perhaps they don't group posts into threads, so you get hit with about ten times as many messages as I do. That would be frustrating. I still don't personally support moderation, but if most of the list does, then we should see what options we have. > **···** > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 11:06 AM, Dylan Northrup \ wrote: > > > It's gotten to an unusable space for me. I regularly delete all messages > > after scanning the subjects without reading them. Up until approximately a > > month ago I would actually read the majority of the posts to see what is > > posted as well as learn from example code posted by others. But given the > > recent spate of off-topic garbage the list has pretty much become unusable. > > > > I'm hopeful that something will change and the spammers/off-topic posts > > will > > go elsewhere, but would very much appreciate being able to have someone > > step > > in to stop the madness. > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 11:15 AM, Tony Arcieri \wrote: > > > For what it's worth, I've considered unsubscribing due to the high volume > > of > > off-topic email. ---
**Author:** ![Andrea\_Dallera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Andrea\_Dallera](https://rubytalk.org/u/Andrea_Dallera)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 16:35 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/19 "2010-04-14T16:35:47Z")
While the thunk phase's been pretty annoying it looks like now it's over. I suggest to wait a month or so and see if things get better: if not, then I'm all into taking actions against spam and OT. My 2c, > **···** > > -- > Andrea Dallera > > > **[GitHub - bolthar/freightrain: Ruby desktop development made easy](https://github.com/bolthar/freightrain)** > > > > Ruby desktop development made easy. Contribute to bolthar/freightrain development by creating an account on GitHub. > > > **[using (IMHO)](https://usingimho.wordpress.com/)** > > > > Andrea Dallera 's blog > > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 01:15 +0900, Tony Arcieri wrote: > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 9:08 AM, Josh Cheek \ wrote: > > > > \> Unless things got completely unusable, I'd much prefer if there wasn't > > \> someone with the power to kick people off the list > > > > For what it's worth, I've considered unsubscribing due to the high volume of > > off-topic email. ---
**Author:** ![jonty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/90db22/32.png) [@jonty](https://rubytalk.org/u/jonty)\ **Post date:** [14 April 2010 17:27 UTC](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146/20 "2010-04-14T17:27:23Z")
I have just rescanned my ruby-talk inbox folder - I can't see any'off topic' threads, what do you mean by off-topic? There is a wide variety of discussions, many of which I feel free to ignore but because there is no further filtering I often find myself drawn in to an interesting discussion that improves my programming practice. Are you being a little narrow minded? [Next page](https://rubytalk.org/t/who-maintains-ruby-talk/58146.md?page=2)