Python looking better

... though they need someone to improve the grammar:

They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.

···

--
James Britt

http://www.ruby-doc.org - Ruby Help & Documentation
http://www.artima.com/rubycs/ - The Journal By & For Rubyists
http://www.rubystuff.com - The Ruby Store for Ruby Stuff
http://refreshingcities.org - Design, technology, usability

James Britt wrote:

.. though they need someone to improve the grammar:

http://www.python.org/

They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.

I've seen a new Ruby homepage proposal somewhere.... iirc

lopex

In article <440CCBD8.7060006@neurogami.com>,

···

James Britt <james_b@neurogami.com> wrote:

.. though they need someone to improve the grammar:

http://www.python.org/

Speaking of improved language websites... wasn't there an effort afoot (more
than a year ago I think) to improve Ruby's website? Some nice looking protoype
sites were produced, but nothing ever came of it... what gives?

BTW: we can also put "NASA uses Ruby" on our website too :wink:

Phil

James Britt wrote:

.. though they need someone to improve the grammar:

http://www.python.org/

I feel left out. Where's our "NASA uses Ruby" ad?

:slight_smile:

···

--
Bil
http://fun3d.larc.nasa.gov

... though they need someone to improve the grammar:

http://www.python.org/

They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.

IMO, the Ruby site redesign guys are on a much better track. Who
really cares whether NASA uses Python? One thing I learned from having
to sit through too many software marketing presentations is that
organizations like NASA are to software what the Library of Congress
is to books. I finally started interrupting presenters to ask
something like "Do you realize that *all* of your competitors have
LANL on their peer-pressure slide too?" Most actually didn't!

Steve

Phil Tomson wrote:

···

James Britt <james_b@neurogami.com> wrote:

http://www.python.org/

BTW: we can also put "NASA uses Ruby" on our website too :wink:

The curious thing is that when I went to the success stories
page, and did text-search for "NASA", it came up empty?

--
Bil
http://fun3d.larc.nasa.gov

Its still going on as far as I know, just progressing slowly. The blog is here:

http://redhanded.hobix.com/redesign2005/

- Rob

···

On 3/6/06, Marcin Mielżyński <lopexx@autograf.pl> wrote:

James Britt wrote:
> .. though they need someone to improve the grammar:
>
> http://www.python.org/
>
>
> They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.
>

I've seen a new Ruby homepage proposal somewhere.... iirc

lopex

--
http://www.robsanheim.com/
http://www.ajaxian.com/

Steven Lumos wrote:

... though they need someone to improve the grammar:

http://www.python.org/

They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.

IMO, the Ruby site redesign guys are on a much better track. Who
really cares whether NASA uses Python? One thing I learned from having
to sit through too many software marketing presentations is that
organizations like NASA are to software what the Library of Congress
is to books. I finally started interrupting presenters to ask
something like "Do you realize that *all* of your competitors have
LANL on their peer-pressure slide too?" Most actually didn't!

There's an argument to be made that language advocacy, and "selling"
Ruby (or Python or Lisp or whatever), is distasteful.

There's also a counterargument suggesting that the language and its
community will be better off for the greater exposure and mainstream use.

I believe that language marketing itself is fine, though it can be
poorly or distastefully done. People looking to code Ruby for a living are helped if HR people or recruiters or whomever have heard of Ruby; people currently trying to persuade their coworkers or boss to adopt Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists they know.

But there is the counter-counterargument that it is more important to attract the right kind of people, not simply large crowds of indiscriminate coders. And that poor marketing (e.g., My language is cool, your language is a mouse poop sandwich) will turn people off.

I'd like to think that if you make the intrinsic strengths of Ruby obvious then it will (continue to) attract the people who will help make it better (by keen observations, code submission, library creation), which in turn will draw the attention of the more practical-minded.

But it may be that "success story" blurbs are still needed to win over project managers and such.

···

--
James Britt

"In physics the truth is rarely perfectly clear, and that is certainly
  universally the case in human affairs. Hence, what is not surrounded by
  uncertainty cannot be the truth."
  - R. Feynman

Bil Kleb wrote:

Phil Tomson wrote:
>>http://www.python.org/
>
> BTW: we can also put "NASA uses Ruby" on our website too :wink:

The curious thing is that when I went to the success stories
page, and did text-search for "NASA", it came up empty?

Search for "shuttle". Or just click on the photo on the front page.

···

> James Britt <james_b@neurogami.com> wrote:

Rob Sanheim wrote:
...>

Its still going on as far as I know, just progressing slowly. The blog is here:

http://redhanded.hobix.com/redesign2005/

Some interesting comments on Reddit about the new Python look:

http://reddit.com/info?id=2t2w

···

--
James Britt

http://www.ruby-doc.org - Ruby Help & Documentation
http://www.artima.com/rubycs/ - The Journal By & For Rubyists
http://www.rubystuff.com - The Ruby Store for Ruby Stuff
http://refreshingcities.org - Design, technology, usability

James,

But there is the counter-counterargument that it is more important to
attract the right kind of people, not simply large crowds of
indiscriminate coders. And that poor marketing (e.g., My language is
cool, your language is a mouse poop sandwich) will turn people off.

Nice.

I just wanted to take a moment and applaud you for your valid
contributions in amusing packages. It really does keep a lot of the
conversations fresh and educational even after years of lurking...

Thanks.

Cameron

James Britt wrote:

Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

Pistos

···

--
Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.

I can assure you that it is still progressing. It has been slow
progress, but much faster in recent months (thanks to John Long).
Hopefully a few more months and it'll be all finished.

Curt

···

On 3/7/06, Rob Sanheim <rsanheim@gmail.com> wrote:

On 3/6/06, Marcin Mielżyński <lopexx@autograf.pl> wrote:
> James Britt wrote:
> > .. though they need someone to improve the grammar:
> >
> > http://www.python.org/
> >
> >
> > They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.
> >
>
> I've seen a new Ruby homepage proposal somewhere.... iirc
>
> lopex
>
>

Its still going on as far as I know, just progressing slowly. The blog is here:

http://redhanded.hobix.com/redesign2005/

Karl von Laudermann wrote:

Search for "shuttle". Or just click on the photo on the front page.

Ah, so it's not NASA, but a NASA contractor...

···

--
Bil
http://fun3d.larc.nasa.gov

Which was supposed to be off-list. My apologies for my blunding fingers.

···

On 3/9/06, Cameron McBride <cameron.mcbride@gmail.com> wrote:

James,

> But there is the counter-counterargument that it is more important to
> attract the right kind of people, not simply large crowds of
> indiscriminate coders. And that poor marketing (e.g., My language is
> cool, your language is a mouse poop sandwich) will turn people off.

Nice.

I just wanted to take a moment and applaud you for your valid
contributions in amusing packages. It really does keep a lot of the
conversations fresh and educational even after years of lurking...

Thanks.

Cameron

It's always a bus because the bus has a long and venerable tradition in taking out programmers.
See: http://web.archive.org/web/20000422005356/http://segfault.org/story.phtml?mode=2&id=38b40d78-087dd360

···

On Mar 10, 2006, at 9:58 AM, Pistos Christou wrote:

James Britt wrote:

Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

Pistos

--
Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.

Pistos Christou wrote:

James Britt wrote:

Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists? Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft? *momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a hovercraft* tricycles?

Because there is no such thing (yet) as hovercraft tricycle errors, but there are (still) bus errors.

I can't tell you how many projects I've seen fail due to
hovercraft-related issues.

···

On 3/10/06, Pistos Christou <jesusrubsyou.5.pistos@geoshell.com> wrote:

James Britt wrote:
> Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
> Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
> they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

It's so you can use the phrase "bus error", which has an air of humerous
ambiguity to it. Like "carbon-based error".

;Daniel

···

On 11/03/06, Pistos Christou <jesusrubsyou.5.pistos@geoshell.com> wrote:

>> Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers?

--
Daniel Baird
http://danielbaird.com (TiddlyW;nks! :: Whiteboard Koala :: Blog :: Things
That Suck)
[[My webhost uptime is ~ 92%.. if no answer pls call again later!]]

*nods*

On a happier note, last week the team I work in took a vote on using Ruby for development. They're a 15 strong group. A mix of developers and QC people, about a 50-50 split, and a few managers. Their criteria for choosing was simply "Will you be happy to maintain code that is written in Ruby?" The majority were, so now I can happily develop with Ruby, rather than keeping the pickaxe hidden on my knees under my desk :slight_smile:

In trying to convince them, my major selling points were that:

* Ruby is being used by other people - it's a mature language.

* Ruby has some significant advantages as a language; comes with superb tools and modules, making it highly productive and enjoyable; and has a vibrant and active community.

* Ruby code should be more maintainable than (in this case) Perl, because it encourages modular, well structured design. This is far more important to rapid understanding, than a maintainer's familiarity with the language.

But I think I can hear the distant drone of an encroaching hovercraft, so I will leave you, and try to finish what I can before my appointment with destiny.

Cheers,
  Benjohn

···

On 11 Mar 2006, at 03:30, Wilson Bilkovich wrote:

On 3/10/06, Pistos Christou <jesusrubsyou.5.pistos@geoshell.com> > wrote:

James Britt wrote:

Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

I can't tell you how many projects I've seen fail due to
hovercraft-related issues.